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Yikes!!

HRC supporters were treated like crap in 2008 and now HRC supporters only in 2016 (if she runs) want everyone else to leave here???

Will wonders never cease..

This seems so cray-cray to me. (and unnecessary)

Guess the Pasture will have to do.

But I'll be lurking:) unless something grand happens.

OY!

boots and pants, boots and pants, boots and pants.....

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Comment Preferences

  •  Tip Jar (24+ / 0-)

    "Life without emotions is like an engine without fuel."

    "It's said that the honest man has nothing to hide. Not true. The honest man has to hide himself, because honest men are the prime targets of those who lie."

    by roseeriter on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 02:41:33 AM PDT

  •  Oceania was always at war (11+ / 0-)

    with Eastasia.

    The thing about quotes on the internet is you cannot confirm their validity. ~Abraham Lincoln

    by raboof on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 03:54:19 AM PDT

  •  It does seem a little crazy. (17+ / 0-)

    I left in '08 and stayed away for 5 years. What's even crazier is that when I came back to say that I was wrong about Obama a large faction of Dkos had turned against him.

    I've supported Hillary from day one and made no bones about it but I don't ask or expect anyone to leave here because they disagree. If you leave it's your own choice. Own it.

    I'm not paranoid or anything. Everyone just thinks I am.

    by Jim Riggs on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 04:20:41 AM PDT

    •  "A large faction of Dkos" wouldn't support (25+ / 0-)

      democrats no matter what.

      They sign on and attack Obama, Biden, Krugman, Sanders, PPACA, et.al. plus posting imaginary numbers for everything from poverty to deficits to war.

      Goes with the territory.

      And I'll support whoever is to the left of her in the primaries, then send her money and my time in the general election cuz she's not a fascist. The GOPers ??? Yeah, they are.

      "Stealing kids' lunch money makes them strong and independent." -- Rand Paul Ryan

      by waterstreet2013 on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 04:55:52 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That sounds completely reasonable. (13+ / 0-)

        Are you sure you belong here? lol

        I'm not paranoid or anything. Everyone just thinks I am.

        by Jim Riggs on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 05:06:52 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I'm sure he does. I feel the same (13+ / 0-)

          way.  And nothing that kos has said has in any way led me to believe otherwise.  

          With the Decision Points Theater, the George W. Bush Presidential Library becomes the very first Presidential Library to feature a Fiction Section.

          by Its the Supreme Court Stupid on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 05:16:50 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Re: "Fiction Section." (5+ / 0-)

            The Reagan Library has rewritten the First Inaugural Address. They excised the line where he told the crowd that the embassy hostages had been released and were "in the air !!!"

            Contrast video of the speech with the prettied up version.

            We'd also like to know how much money changed hands to get that result: the hostages being held in Teheran through all of Carter's term in office and then released on January 20, 1981, to coincide with the Reagan inauguration.

            Betcha it was more than $10.

            "Stealing kids' lunch money makes them strong and independent." -- Rand Paul Ryan

            by waterstreet2013 on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 05:34:05 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Precisely (7+ / 0-)

            Same here.

            The reason there was a problem with the "Hillary Faction" (to the best of my recollection) in 2008 was that once the primaries were over, they were OVER. But the divide between "Hillary Supporters" and "Obama Supporters" was so deep that even Hillary Clinton tossing her support over to Obama didn't change things here.

            People were angry and upset, and chose to take it out on each other instead of putting that anger to use in more productive ways. Thus the split became deeper, and even though Hillary Clinton was no longer running, the "Party Unity My Ass" group came into being...

            I originally wanted Gore to get in the race. I didn't know Barack Obama to start with, Hillary Clinton already had a lot of hate aimed at her from all sides, and I wasn't really paying attention to Edwards back then. When the primaries finally came, I hate to admit it, but I voted for Edwards, because he seemed to care about the poor. It's a bit embarrassing to admit that now, though. He fooled a lot of us, didn't he?

            I don't get it, to be honest. Why are people so wedded to one candidate or another? After I voted in the primaries, I started studying the candidates (and then Barack Obama literally brushed off the negativity from the Clinton side, and that caught my attention). After Obama refused to throw mud back at Hillary, I was very happy to vote for him.

            But if Hillary Clinton had won the primaries, I would have happily voted for her, as well. Because when it comes down to it, there are exactly two choices in the general election, and you either choose one, or forfeit your vote and your voice in the election.

            The GOTP is insane. Seriously. And this IS NOT JUST ABOUT ME. It is my civic duty to vote for the person I think will help this country the most, and I don't see the GOTP candidate as EVER being that person. Not unless there is a drastic change in their party, and they become more compassionate (not gonna happen in my lifetime).

            My vote is mine, but it matters to the rest of the country as well, because the winner of the election will determine much of the course of the nation over the next four years. Voting is something I hold dear, and will never take lightly.

            Hell, people DIED to give me the right to vote. Aside from all else I mentioned, I wouldn't spit in their faces. I'll crawl on my hands and knees to my polling place if that's what it takes to get there.

            And I'll vote for whichever Democrat wins the primaries. Always!!

            "We have only the moral ground we actually inhabit, not the moral ground we claim." - It Really Is That Important

            by Diogenes2008 on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 09:46:28 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  voting in the general election (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              waterstreet2013
              But if Hillary Clinton had won the primaries, I would have happily voted for her, as well. Because when it comes down to it, there are exactly two choices in the general election, and you either choose one, or forfeit your vote and your voice in the election.
              Just one more (realistic) candidate than the people get in North Korea or Cuba. Yeah, I get it. It's unfortunate, but that really is the way that it is.

              I actually have the rare privilege of casting a third-party protest vote. Why? Because no matter how I vote, and no matter what other actions I may take, the GOTP will get my County's electoral votes. It's an occupational hazard of living in El Paso County, Colorado (seat: Colorado Springs).

              sigh......

              "It's high time (and then some) that we put an end to the exceptionalistic nonsense floating around in our culture and face the fact that either the economy works for all, or it doesn't work AT all." -- Sean McCullough (DailyKos user thanatokephaloides)

              by thanatokephaloides on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 01:51:46 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  Oh, give me a fucking break! (32+ / 0-)

    NOBODY has said that non-Hillary supporters must leave.  Nobody! Quit reading things into what has been written that were never there.

    With the Decision Points Theater, the George W. Bush Presidential Library becomes the very first Presidential Library to feature a Fiction Section.

    by Its the Supreme Court Stupid on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 04:24:38 AM PDT

  •  Way too early to hand off a nomination to (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    roseeriter, Lawrence, Sylv, Chi, Oh Mary Oh

    anybody.  What happens over the next two years will aim us toward the best candidate.  The GOP majorities will continue to screw things up.

    Building a better America with activism, cooperation, ingenuity and snacks.

    by judyms9 on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 04:53:25 AM PDT

    •  A lot can happen in a year plus (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      judyms9, MKSinSA

      Something might happen that causes Clinton not to run -- health issues (either her own or family members), better job offer somewhere else, or maybe even a case of "Take this job and shove it" when it comes to dealing with Republican asshattery. I worry that so much focus on Clinton as the nominee will keep the Democrats from being prepared if something does happen and Clinton doesn't run.

      There's only one rule that I know of, babies -- goddammit, you've got to be kind. -- Kurt Vonnegut

      by Cali Scribe on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 11:58:07 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  at the moment I'd rather focus on the Mid-Terms (16+ / 0-)

    than far-away 2016

    We're shocked by a naked nipple, but not by naked aggression.

    by Lepanto on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 05:10:41 AM PDT

  •  Nobody, at least among my colleagues, (43+ / 0-)

    really gives a shit about any politician in particular. We care about a broadly shared agenda and advancing that agenda through the Democratic Party, the only vehicle available.

    If our broadly shared agenda is best advanced by Barack Obama, we will go with him. If it is best advanced by Hillary Clinton, we will go with her. We don't give a shit about politicians. We care about an agenda.

    The only way you get to move the ball forward on an agenda is if you have power.

    The only way you get any power is by winning elections.

    The calculus, at least for most of us at Daily Kos, is fucking simple. It isn't a complex metaphysical experience in progressivism. It's a grounded, clear headed, direct approach to sorting out who gets the power in America.

    So for those of you who think "Oh Daily Kos was all pro Obama and Anti-Hillary and then went all Anti-Obama and stabbed Obama in the back, and then now they're all loyal to Hillary when they should have been with her in the first place"  or whatever, fuck you.  This isn't about anybody's feelings. It's about moving the ball forward, and sometimes just keeping the ball out of the hands of the enemies of decent people, namely all Republicans. Whatever it takes to win, that's all that we care about.

    We would rather fight for more progressive policies with our guys in power rather than bitch from the sidelines with no power at all. Sometimes that means we take our own folks to task, and sometimes they're so awful we let them twist in the wind and die off. But until we've got a non-white majority in this country this is how its going to be. So if folks either have their head in the sky, or they're all despondent and pissed off, or whatever it is that keeps you from "more and better Democrats" then get the fuck out. This shit is not hard to comprehend.

    •  send to Top Comments (11+ / 0-)

      excellent!

      When two frat boys have a kerfuffle, it's a brohaha. Bubbanomics

      by raina on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 07:47:44 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  That is why the attitude expressed by Kos and DOV (5+ / 0-)

      Is really nonsense.

      "Love it or leave it" is not the way to build a power base.

      That middle finger just lost this site not only some pretty dedicated and long time members, but also Subscriber/Donators that keep the lights on and prime the power pump you refer to.

      Strictly from the viewpoint of enlightened self-interest, you'd think they would throttle it back just to avoid offending people they might want/need later.

      Markos' cocky repose didn't surprise me at all, dickishness is his usual response to criticism, but I was kind of disappointed they Denise came off the rails.

      You are not doing much better.

      Shall I get the fuck out and stop bothering you?

      My way or the highway?

      Well, that's a pretty convincing recruitment slogan. Good work.

      No one is coming to save us, the future is in our hands.

      by koNko on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 08:18:30 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Comparing the Busha and Obama years (0+ / 0-)

      Progressives fought a lot harder with Bush in power.  Many on the left and many Democrats won't fight him -- at all.  And that fractures any power the left has to move the ball forward.  IOKIYAAD.

      Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

      by The Dead Man on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 08:42:18 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I disagree completely. (6+ / 0-)

        I think you've seen exactly what moving the ball forward, on some fronts, not ALL, is when you have a Democrat in power versus a Republican.

        Progressive can't expect to get 100% out of any politician, I don't care how wonderful. The power in this country is highly concentrated in the hands of the enemy. Demographics and time are on our side, but these things take time to pencil out. In the meantime, we have to keep pushing ahead with whatever we've got.

        Nobody can ever doubt my criticism on several fronts, or my praise on fronts where there is noticeable improvement over Republicans. But it is what it is. A lot of Democrats really fuckin suck. But they are been carefully weeded out and the party core is getting better. Witness the striking decline of blue dogs and recent elections of more progressives to high office, including here in New York.

        We have to keep pushing ahead and stop all this navel gazing and hand wringing. Clinton at the top of the ticket means folks like us, the informed class, can devote our energies to other shit that is far more important. Like downballot and local, where we are getting pummeled.

        •  Can't take your eyes off the top (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          congenitalefty

          Having Obama or another Clinton does not mean that at the national level things are safe or ignorable.  Income inequality is increasing, climate change is getting worse, the national security state is spying on everyone, and on and on.  These aren't white man privilege problems.  And they're occurring under a "D" administration.

          I am not discounting downballot, but assuming that the upballot is safe because of the celebrity so crowned is unwise.

          Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

          by The Dead Man on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 09:58:52 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  The direction of the country is a national issue. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Susan from 29

            No question about it. The numbers are awful, and have been for a long time. That is EXACTLY why Clinton is the best person we can put forward. I said this some years ago when I was laying out my rationale for Clinton:

            She's the ONLY Democrat big enough to seperate from Obama without losing his voters.

            Its that simple. Nobody else will be able to overcome the Obama fatigue around their necks. That base he has is still extremely loyal, but to HIM, not Democrats generally. Hillary Clinton is the only person who has the stature to do this without Obama. She's the only person those folks would turn out for because she's a known quantity. No introductions are necessary.

            The second and equally important factor is women. I am dead certain that the 2016 election is going to be a major pushback from American women. Especially if Hillary Clinton is leading the ticket.

            We've seen this coalition proven through two national elections. It is the winning formula, plain and simple. We are once again also giften with a weak Republican field. We can beat any of those guys with Clinton by a mile. Put someone else up and we've got a divided party with a lame duck president hanging over it. Just like the GOP in 2008. Well, not that bad, but you get the drift.

            Hillary Clinton's job will be to deal with the national direction issue and as far as I can see she's the only person we've got who could talk about it with credibility. Will she have a corporate administration? Yes. Just like we've got now. But I'd rather have that in her hands while we can work on where some of the real problems are like Congress and state houses. Once that's done, we will inevitably have to tackle this corporate Democrat problem but right now the left is too disorganized to deal with it. I think THAT job should go to Elizabeth Warren who could serve as a powerful counterweight. ESPECIALLY with all the GOP seats in the Senate that are up in 2016. We might see her with a gavel sooner than expected.

            We're in good shape. Not ideal, but poised for growth. As long as we don't blow by getting stupid.

        •  Who is doing the hand-wringing? (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          congenitalefty, JayRaye

          Seems to me, some people were just minding their own business expressing their opinions and participating here, and then a FP'r started a pie-fight and told them to love it or leave, a position now reinforced by the site owner and, apparently, you as well.

          Well, OK, clear the deck if that's what you think will get the job done, but if it is impractical nonsense to expect perfection from politicians, why do you expect that from political bloggers?

          I thought it was supposed to be a Big Tent.

          One way to look at some of the people who left is you lost some good foot solders. That's how I look at it.

          I would not be breaking your back on this if it was a case of some marginal trolls, hence my link back to one of the cases, facts in evidence if you will.

          Seriously, the attitude taken by Denise and Markos is really a problem, and I will say more on Markos because I considered Denise's diary (a) a rant, so keep it in context, and (b) a bit out of character for her.

          My comment on her diary was this, and I'll leave it at that for now.

          Markos needs to grow-up a little.

          Magic Words: "I'm sorry, maybe I need to reconsider this."

          Not holding my breath.

          No one is coming to save us, the future is in our hands.

          by koNko on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 10:59:42 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I don't care what Markos said, (0+ / 0-)

            or what you say he said. This place is for More and Better Democrats, where Hillary currently stands for more, and her unknown successor for better. And if not Hillary, then let it be because someone better comes along who can also beat any Republican with one hand tied behind her back.

            As much a I find meta fascinating, I am going to put most of my efforts into supporting actual candidates and advancing actual issues, and only telling off trolls and spammers and the actual opposition, not allies whom I disagree with about something.

            I recommend taking it that there are some here whom you will never agree with, whom you will never get along with, and whom you can ignore while you have a real discussion with the rest of us. Of course, when someone invades a Diary, other measures may be required. Do you know that if you shift-click on the little triangle by a comment, it hides the entire thread from your view?

            Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

            by Mokurai on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 10:40:20 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Not sure I get the point of your lecture (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              JayRaye

              Given that fact that what I am arguing for here is tolerance and a big tent, which would tend to multiply practical results. You might get that if you read my comments up and down this thread.

              But if my criticism of Markos bothers you that much, there is that little triangle.

              No one is coming to save us, the future is in our hands.

              by koNko on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 09:32:20 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  This (0+ / 0-)

      Is why we are losing

      Whatever it takes to win, that's all that we care about.
      •  No, McGovern is called losing. Mondale is losing. (5+ / 0-)

        We're taking our hits, but we are far from losing.

        •  Really (5+ / 0-)

          Tell me the trajectory in the last 20 years of workers wages?  The status of minority communities?  How about environmental protections?  Civil liberties?  Reproductive rights?  Humans rights?  Economic justice?

          This is what winning looks like to you?

          •  No it doesn't look like winning. (5+ / 0-)

            Everything we care about is falling further behind. But why?

            When you get to the root cause of it, it is because good Democrats aren't winning elections. That's the root of the problem pure simple. So what we have to do FIRST, is win more elections. Then we have to win Democratic primaries with better Democrats. That's a process because the Democrats we have had for a long long time have sucked. But it IS getting better. Both in the quality of our people and in the number of elections we win and where we win them.

            California is going through what we need to go through nationally. We first have to vanquish Republicans to the point where they simply can't win anymore. Then we have to deal with fixing the direction of our own party as California is now having to do.

            Nationally, in due time, the electorate is going to look very much like California.

            •  Good democrats aren't winning elections, so... (3+ / 0-)

              we entrench and enrich bad democrats by voting them into the system?  What does it do to the Democratic Brand to have these democrats set the example for what the democratic party stands for?  What does it do / has it done to the party when they are voted in and begin setting the Democratic agenda?

              It hasn't worked in the last several decades why should it suddenly work now?  Is it any wonder that "both parties are the same" is able to take root in the public's mind?  It would be interesting to see if your California example bears any fruit, or will being neoliberal/Republican-lite bear unintended fruit?  I don't follow much California politics, but what the Democratic governor has done to the waterways is unforgivable.

              Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

              by The Dead Man on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 07:09:47 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  I mostly agree with what you say BBB but here we (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              koNko

              are in CA today fighting our D gov. tooth and nail about fracking and water policy. sigh.

              if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

              by mrsgoo on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 10:05:02 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  Reagan recruited the Reagan Democrats (0+ / 0-)

            to the Southern Strategy coalition, so Reagan won two terms, and Bush got one term. Rove got 2000 close enough to steal in Florida, and drove turnout in 2004 with Gay Marriage ballot measures, plus stealing Ohio. There is nobody left that the Tea Parties will allow Republicans to recruit, and the electoral shenanigans are close to running out, including voter suppression and the gerrymanders. The Supreme Court made it much harder, but we can still do it, and we will be able to fix the Supreme Court in the next few years. Also, we have our own round of ballot measures to drive turnout with, including legalizing marijuana and increasing the minimum wage.

            The trajectory turned anti-Progressive back in Nixon's time, with the original Southern Strategy. LBJ predicted the loss of the South for a generation when he signed the Civil Rights Act, but he kept right on with the Voting Rights Act and the Great Society War on Poverty. (Vietnam made it much worse.) The trajectory is turning back at about 1% of the population annually. Another 5-10% demographic and generational shift will bring us to the tipping point. The funny thing about a tipping point is that nothing seems to happen until you reach one, and then everything starts to happen at once.

            After we nuke the gerrymanders, whether by winning the states one at a time, or in a new Voting Rights Act after we take the House again, there will be no way for the Republicans to come back. In fact, I predict that they will implode completely, in the manner of the Federalist opponents of Thomas Jefferson coming apart seven years later, and leaving the country to the Democratic-Republicans for 18 years until the rise of the Whigs. It was called the Era of Good Feelings.

            Can you imagine Democratic politics if we never have to appease or triangulate?

            It's easy if you try.
            John Lennon
            Keep your eyes on the prize.
            Modern version of folk song

            Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

            by Mokurai on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 11:02:34 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  When we fight to elect people who (4+ / 0-)

          Use their power to minimize these priorities or actively speak against them we have a problem.

    •  Hard to fight when you're not even invited to the (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      congenitalefty

      table (as the single payer proponents were -- they were shut out by Congress and the WH; or the fact we even have to have a multi-year "fight" to get KXL cancelled (a no brainer Democratic position to take) and its still likely to be approved) and outright derided as "fucking retards" and "professional leftists."  If there is to be change it will have to come from someplace other than within the only two political parties we can choose from.

      Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

      by The Dead Man on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 06:59:35 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The party apparatus is not the party (0+ / 0-)

        It is those who vote for the party, and those who work for the party. We set the agenda. They can only pick candidates and decide how to raise and spend money.

        When we understand how to push the buttons, we can move forward on the issues, no matter what shenanigans the professionals and money people on either side think is going on.

        See Marriage Equality for how it can be done.

        Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

        by Mokurai on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 11:07:12 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  If that were true, the KXL protests would have (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          koNko

          been successful a long time ago.

          Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

          by The Dead Man on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 04:50:07 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Protesting KXL is on the agenda (0+ / 0-)

            and has gone a lot further than the politicians want, and a lot farther than politicians and industry believed possible, against an incredible disinformation campaign that we didn't push back against effectively for many years. Now we are.

            Global Warming is high on the agenda. We are at the tipping point that we call Grid Parity, where coal-fired power plants can't get funding in the open financial market, and have to make corrupt deals with legislatures and development banks.

            I like to say that the funny thing about a tipping point is that nothing seems to happen until you reach one, and then it all starts to happen at once.

            We got the NRA to the bargaining table. They only backed off when they themselves were Tea Partied from further to the Right by Gun Owners of America (GOA) and the National Association for Gun Rights (NAGR).

            All of the issues that are in play are due to public opinion, not politicians. The criterion is not that we have already won, but that we are advancing.

            Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

            by Mokurai on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 08:39:58 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Obama can kill it if he wants to. (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              JayRaye

              He has that power.

              With no elections ahead now, this is a test of his commitment and political will, and will seal his legacy on the environment.

              Voters elected him twice based on promises, now is his time to stand and deliver.

              Let's see what happens.

              No one is coming to save us, the future is in our hands.

              by koNko on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 09:44:02 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  By the way (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              JayRaye

              I'd be very happy if global warming was high on the agenda but see no evidence of this.

              Certianly not in Congress. Not much in the White House when it comes to heavy lifting.

              What Obama has done on Environment has been mostly low hanging fruit he could pick viv a vis his executive powers over the EPA and DoE, but when it comes to expending political capital, Environment got quickly demoted on his agenda and is mainly a subject of lip service now.

              Clearly ACA was his first term priority and avoiding becoming a lame duck prematurely now seems to be the second term priority.

              But, there is KXL to be decided and he is the decider, so this is his big opportunity if he wants to take it.

              He could really do a good thing, a very important and worthwhile thing, and I hope he does, but I'm less than 100% confident on the outcome.

              No one is coming to save us, the future is in our hands.

              by koNko on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 09:56:10 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  The agenda of those who matter on the issue (0+ / 0-)

                Those doing the real political work. Not the ignorant public, and not craven politicians.

                We agree that we have to keep pushing. I tend to see the glass as half full, but our real problem is the Koch brothers claiming that it is their glass.

                Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

                by Mokurai on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 01:41:18 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Congress is a serious roadblock (0+ / 0-)

                  A glass 1/4 full at best, so I doubt much will be accomplished soon there.

                  Cities and states are and will lead. That I have confidence in.

                  No one is coming to save us, the future is in our hands.

                  by koNko on Sun Mar 16, 2014 at 06:57:46 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

  •  If it keeps you from making diaries (6+ / 0-)

    That are about as interesting to read as the back of my shampoo bottle, then I am not going to cry about it. If you really have to go Meta, how about at least fleshing out your diary so someone might understand why you are making this plaintive noise? Your diary is so ambiguously written, I am not even sure what you are getting at. Does this really need to be a diary? Does anyone really care everytime someone announces their personal decision about how much they will be writing on or visiting Kos when important things are actually going on in the world and the country? If you want me to care about your decision, you will have to try harder than this. Educate me about something I did not know, persuade me to believe in your cause, or at least just give me a reason as to why your decision should matter to anyone else. These Meta diaries are so immature and self-absorbed. Whenever I decide not to post here (once, for almost two years), I never feel the need to announce it. I just do it. But then, I am not someone who denigrates myself or takes action in the hope that others will use it as an opportunity to give me an ego boost.

    No one really drives people away. People leave when they cannot stand other people not agreeing with them enough. If you believe in what you are saying, then who cares what someone here thinks about it? If people persistently upset you, then just stop clicking on them and give the people who like interacting with you a reason to do so. Or engage in some healthy debate. I have learned a lot from having my views challenged at Kos--not just about issues but about people and the Internet in general.

    **Electing Republicans to the government is like hiring pyromaniacs as firemen. They all just want to see everything burn to the ground.**

    by CatM on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 05:22:26 AM PDT

  •  What does Hillary Clinton have to do with all of (12+ / 0-)

    this?

    I'm not a big fan of hers, although she did grow on me somewhat when she was willing to become S.O.S. and be a unifying force after 2008, but whether I vote for her or not in the 2016 primaries will depend on her positions and who the other candidates in the primary are.

    If she does become the nominee, however, I'll definitely vote for her and do my best to ensure that she gets as progressive of a Congress as possible to work with.

    It's a no-brainer, really.

    Anyway, we have midterms coming up before 2016, so it really is kind of silly right now to talk about Hillary Clinton so much.

    "A candle loses nothing by lighting another candle" - Mohammed Nabbous, R.I.P.

    by Lawrence on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 05:35:00 AM PDT

    •  It's a symptom of the rightward march of the Party (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Don midwest, flowerfarmer

      Which in turn makes it a focal point of those of us who want the Democrats to move in a Better direction -- and not be an unthinking, amoral "winning" machine that is just as much a tool of the 1% as the Republicans are.

      Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

      by The Dead Man on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 08:45:58 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I'd like to post info (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Susan from 29

    from the past that would show what is really going on ,
    but you might find that intimidating and you then might freak out ,
    so I'll not do it .

    What I will say is ,
    the level of bullshit / crapola / missinfo that is gleefully spread around and taken up as truth on this site is astounding .

    "please love deeply...openly and genuinely." A. M. H.

    by indycam on Sat Mar 15, 2014 at 07:51:42 AM PDT

  •  seriously, your premise (2+ / 0-)

    is  not accurate,

    "HRC supporters only in 2016 (if she runs) want everyone else to leave here???"

    total hyperbole

    this blog deserves better . and by that i mean a better effort by folks to take a breath and separate reality from reaction,

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